Silverado EV Forum banner
21 - 37 of 37 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
There’s a disconnection in the EV market pricing. In China and Europe (which is getting a lot of Chinese EV’s) there’s a price war going on. Tesla just dropped the price of the 3 over there which crashed their web site from orders. You can get a lot of EV goodness in China for not much money. But we’re not getting (and will probably never) get Chinese EV’s in the US, so Detroit auto is doing the opposite and slowing adoption with crazy prices.

But the IRA/Inflation Reduction Act resulted in every mfg on the planet dog piling in the rust belt to build EV‘s and especially batteries, so I hope we‘ll see that here too.

Trucks unfortunately are a premium vehicles from the last 20 years of people willing to pay more for leather seats and crap. Not sure the EV will work for my towing needs I’ve been doing a lot of ICE Silverado pricing, it’s not too far off from the EV.
 

·
Registered
2022 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD, 2022 Rivian R1T
Joined
·
167 Posts
I'm not surprised, I'm seriously considering getting out of EV now, reports are bad future battery cost, my Mach-e is good, but every now and then it does weird things.
Getting out is up to you. I had a Prius for 16 yrs and no battery issues. Your Mach E wigging out is likely a software issue which as it happens ICE cars also have issues with.

From what I have read, with a little care the batteries will out last the vehicle.

Lastly the price differential between EV and ICE has narrowed quite a bit.

Going EV, especially now, is a bit daunting but it is inevitable ICEs are coming to an end. Time will tell how long it takes before ICEs are outlawed, loose all value and finding a gas station is a challenge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Discussion Starter · #25 ·
I'm not surprised, I'm seriously considering getting out of EV now, reports are bad future battery cost, my Mach-e is good, but every now and then it does weird things.

Not sure which state you're in, but GM's standard warranty on EV batteries is 8 years 100,000 miles. In California, the state requires 10 year 150,000 mile warranty on the battery.

The warranty typically allows for "normal" battery capacity decay... which is about 3.0% per year. So, a battery pack in California could drop to 75% kWh capacity compared to new and it'd still be "ok" in the 10th year. But if that battery pack drops to 75% in the first two years, the automaker is responsible for making things right somehow.

This warranty may not be useful solace to people who are worried about the batteries bursting into flames and burning their house down though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
124 Posts
Time will tell how long it takes before ICEs are outlawed, loose all value and finding a gas station is a challenge.
I can see that happening at some point in places like CA, but I will definitely not see it happening here in TX anytime soon. My estimated 30-some years of driving time should still be well covered. I'll let my kids worry about it when the time comes.
 

·
Registered
2022 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD, 2022 Rivian R1T
Joined
·
167 Posts
I can see that happening at some point in places like CA, but I will definitely not see it happening here in TX anytime soon. My estimated 30-some years of driving time should still be well covered. I'll let my kids worry about it when the time comes.
I can’t really debate your estimate because only time will tell but you may want to Google ‘Texas and EVs’. Texas may never outlaw ICEs but that will not stop Texans from switching to EVs. It hasn’t so far. Incentives to switch are better than most states.

I won’t venture a guess on how many years before EVs/Green Powered vehicles out number exhaust spewing ICEs but it is inevitable, even in the great oil state of Texas.
 

·
Registered
2022 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD, 2022 Rivian R1T
Joined
·
167 Posts
Well it might certainly be delayed has we head into a recession with 80k pickups.
Unfortunately you are right, it will slow EV adoption but won’t stop it.

$80+k ICE and EVs are a lot less affordable due to rising interest rates. Truth be told a good portion of folks parading around in their $80+k vehicles cannot afford them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
124 Posts
I can’t really debate your estimate because only time will tell but you may want to Google ‘Texas and EVs’. Texas may never outlaw ICEs but that will not stop Texans from switching to EVs. It hasn’t so far. Incentives to switch are better than most states.

I won’t venture a guess on how many years before EVs/Green Powered vehicles out number exhaust spewing ICEs but it is inevitable, even in the great oil state of Texas.
I'm not disagreeing with you at all. EV is great and even in Texas they are welcomed. Nothing wrong with that. It's just that with the strong oil/gas lobby, things will not turn around too fast around here.

EV vs. ICE and their greenness or non-greenness is a never ending topic on all levels.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Discussion Starter · #31 · (Edited)
Maybe I'm the out of touch California-jerk but I'm a bit confused about how you all make it seem like a $80k EV is absurdly priced. $70k to $80k for a highly versatile EV truck is a bargain compared to what's out there right now.

Yes, it's relatively expensive compared to some ICE vehicles, but $70k MSRP isn't out of line for EVs in general.

A Tesla Model Y Long Range in black with a tow hitch (class II) costs $70k before taxes and doc fees. It's $80k if you option for 7 seats and some snazzy rims. It's a bit of a stretch to say people can't afford these cars. They're selling like hot cakes and the repos are in the single digits.

The most stripped Rivian R1T with 260 miles range is now $74,500 (with DFC). $80k if you get a normal range battery option. Are people filing for bankruptcy protection just because they buy a Rivian? Probably not... but yeah it's a lot of money that can mess up someone's finances real quick.

Moving up the ladder... go cross shop a Lucid Air edit: (Pure) which is $110k since they don't let you de-content the configuration yet. Or go check out a Tesla Model S. The base Model S with zero option load is now $106k (with DFC). And a Sierra or Silverado First Edition EV are about $110k with DFC and a massive amount of options and interior refinement. The GM First Editions are a comparable bargain with that nice interior and utility compared to a Base Model S. Plus you don't have to worry about the company CEO being a Twitter troll if you get a GM.

Where I think the sticker shock may be setting in is Chevrolet's borderline deceptive advertising to tease a $40k configuration and snag some pre-orders. Tesla did the same thing with the Cybertruck (tease a low possible entry price to snag pre-orders). Ultimately these pre-order shenanigans aren't offers to sell product and there is no purchase agreement. So, they don't have to worry about deceptive pricing/advertising practices.

Bottom line, unless you were one of the early adopters to hop in line for a Rivian at a steep discount, you're paying $80k-ish for a decent EV truck (probably more in 2024). If you're interested in this type of product, take some time now to make sure you can comfortably afford it.
 

·
Registered
2022 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD, 2022 Rivian R1T
Joined
·
167 Posts
Maybe I'm the out of touch California-jerk but I'm a bit confused about how you all make it seem like a $80k EV is absurdly priced. $70k to $80k for a highly versatile EV truck is a bargain compared to what's out there right now.

Yes, it's relatively expensive compared to some ICE vehicles, but $70k MSRP isn't out of line for EVs in general.

A Tesla Model Y Long Range in black with a tow hitch (class II) costs $70k before taxes and doc fees. It's $80k if you option for 7 seats and some snazzy rims. It's a bit of a stretch to say people can't afford these cars. They're selling like hot cakes and the repos are in the single digits.

The most stripped Rivian R1T with 260 miles range is now $74,500 (with DFC). $80k if you get a normal range battery option. Are people filing for bankruptcy protection just because they buy a Rivian? Probably not... but yeah it's a lot of money that can mess up someone's finances real quick.

Moving up the ladder... go cross shop a Lucid Air edit: (Pure) which is $110k since they don't let you de-content the configuration yet. Or go check out a Tesla Model S. The base Model S with zero option load is now $106k (with DFC). And a Sierra or Silverado First Edition EV are about $110k with DFC and a massive amount of options and interior refinement. The GM First Editions are a comparable bargain with that nice interior and utility compared to a Base Model S. Plus you don't have to worry about the company CEO being a Twitter troll if you get a GM.

Where I think the sticker shock may be setting in is Chevrolet's borderline deceptive advertising to tease a $40k configuration and snag some pre-orders. Tesla did the same thing with the Cybertruck (tease a low possible entry price to snag pre-orders). Ultimately these pre-order shenanigans aren't offers to sell product and there is no purchase agreement. So, they don't have to worry about deceptive pricing/advertising practices.

Bottom line, unless you were one of the early adopters to hop in line for a Rivian at a steep discount, you're paying $80k-ish for a decent EV truck (probably more in 2024). If you're interested in this type of product, take some time now to make sure you can comfortably afford it.
Being able to afford something is not simply repo but spending to the point of living paycheck to paycheck and playing games with credit cards. No savings, no nest egg, no retirement ect …
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Being able to afford something is not simply repo but spending to the point of living paycheck to paycheck and playing games with credit cards. No savings, no nest egg, no retirement ect …
Almost every Model Y and Model S owner I know isn't just a HENRY... they're rich already instead of "not rich yet". They're doing just fine and not living paycheck to paycheck. They're doing way better than myself hah.

Where I think GM is creating a mini-problem of sorts is attracting a bunch of prospects with a $40k carrot, only to hit them with the slamboni where a $90k cash-out bill is necessary for the configuration they would actually live with day-to-day. This type of shock causes the thing you're talking about where people get over-leveraged because they get excited by the prospect, and don't bail from the queue in time.

The key is just making sure the future costs don't surprise the buyer when it's time to put cash on the table. Nobody goes into a Model Y purchase today expecting to pay $40k; so there's less of an issue where excitement over the car results in someone paying more than they can comfortably afford. As was mentioned earlier in this thread... paying with cash could be the best option. But that's a very rare bird who is ready to drop $90k cash for a 4WT in 2024.
 

·
Registered
2022 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD, 2022 Rivian R1T
Joined
·
167 Posts
Almost every Model Y and Model S owner I know isn't just a HENRY... they're rich already instead of "not rich yet". They're doing just fine and not living paycheck to paycheck. They're doing way better than myself hah.

Where I think GM is creating a mini-problem of sorts is attracting a bunch of prospects with a $40k carrot, only to hit them with the slamboni where a $90k cash-out bill is necessary for the configuration they would actually live with day-to-day. This type of shock causes the thing you're talking about where people get over-leveraged because they get excited by the prospect, and don't bail from the queue in time.

The key is just making sure the future costs don't surprise the buyer when it's time to put cash on the table. Nobody goes into a Model Y purchase today expecting to pay $40k; so there's less of an issue where excitement over the car results in someone paying more than they can comfortably afford. As was mentioned earlier in this thread... paying with cash could be the best option. But that's a very rare bird who is ready to drop $90k cash for a 4WT in 2024.
I agree with what you are saying but I am talking about all vehicles, ICE and EV.

When wages rise, interest rates drop and folks are a bit more optimistic then $80+k vehicle purchases will take off again.

I am old school and a poor investor as I don’t believe in having debt. For young folks it is inevitable to have some debt and by wanting less and being patient you reduce debt and eventually eliminate it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
224 Posts
The reality that I will live with is a used vehicle, as will most in a recession. GM is putting all their eggs in the EV basket and the price ain’t cheap, with 60% of Americans living paycheck to paycheck and the recession not yet “official” it’s going to get worse before it gets better. We shall see how it plays out, Tesla will be fine with their luxury car customers paying luxury prices for an economy built car. GM sells almost exclusively to economy customers and now is going to ask 80k+ for the EV equivalent of a 55k ICE truck. Plenty of used trucks for 30k or less with equivalent features, no used EV trucks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
124 Posts
As was mentioned earlier in this thread... paying with cash could be the best option. But that's a very rare bird who is ready to drop $90k cash for a 4WT in 2024.
Agreed. Therefore getting something decent for a price in low- to mid-50s could still attract cash buyers. Not 90K. I probably could do that if I made certain arrangements, but there is no way in hell I would drop that kind of cash in a battery on wheels. Or any ICE, for that matter. I'm far from being rich, so therefore I need to make decisions that make sense. 50K+ will make me cringe, but 70-90K+ is a definite no-go.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Yeah almost on cue was the reporting today that said credit card balances are up like 8% since last year and the savings rate is at an all time low of only 3.1% of disposable income.

This isn't just a recession coming around the corner. It'll be a wholesale destruction of consumer credit and livelihoods since a large number of folks are trapped under significant debt with little savings.

But don't worry... we'll get government bailouts when things go south. Folks love to get bailouts (see SBA PPA forgiveness or Student Loan forgiveness). But it seems nobody likes to pay for others to get bailouts. Bummer.

So who's still excited to pay $90k cash to drive a moderately optioned white or black Silverado EV 4WT with cloth manual seats in 2024?
 
21 - 37 of 37 Posts
Top